Kier's new forum software: XenForo

Interesting, can you point me to that thread Kevin?

 

I was going to ask the same thing. I'm curious to see what went down, Kevin.

 

It got pretty heated, so yes, the thread was closed.

You're so wrong.

 

Closed or not, I wanna see it :p

You may have meant deleted...

 

The thread was closed and removed.

I posted my opinion on the zenforo forum software - and what I as a customer wanted in a product. I posted that I wanted a gallery, a wiki, blogs, a content management system,,,, and a few other things. In other words, I want to build something besides a forum.

I also stated that modern forum software like vb 3X series has not seen any major improvements in the past 10 years. So will xenforo be forum software of yesterday, today or tomorrow.

The last post that I saw was someone calling me an idiot, the thread was closed, and it has been removed.

I'am not some high school kid that has to ask mommy and daddy for some money to buy the software. If the software cost $200, so what, I'll drop the coin to get the software I want. After all, I own 3 vbulletin licenses.

The way I was treated at the zenforo forum is not how customers are supposed to be treated. If the developers can not take serious questions from serious customers, I dont know what to think about that - except its very unprofessional.

If I'am looking at buying a Toyota truck, and told the sales guy want I want from my truck - I expect him to answer my questions.

It boils down to this - I told the developers at zenforo what I wanted, I was called an idiot by one of the members, the thread was closed and removed.

Draw your own conclusions.

 

Unfortunately, kind of hard to draw my own conclusions without seeing what actually happened, ah well.

I was just curious as to what happened.

 

Sorry to hear that Kevin, it does seem a bit "fan boyish" over there.
I stopped by when it first opened, it's good to have competition, but it gets a bit crazy when it's new to everyone.
I still don't see it going to production this year, or even by next summer tbh.

 

Nick,
In all honesty and with all due respect vBulletin 4 does work - some of the bugs that SOME say are show stoppers are pretty pathetic and are just there for yet another reason for b!tching.

And playing on a front end of a forum that has been up for what -a month? - doesn't say that it works - and in my opinion that type of post is what gives some people the FAN BOY tag.

XF has more bugs than vB4, some people have vB4 working perfectly on their servers and are happy with what it does - and unlike Kier and co last time IB have listened to the customers and added a CMS, they are working on intergrating the Blogs better and working on the Gallery which is something KIER (as lead developer) and James and co ignored the pleas of their customers for so long.

The fact you see a front end that you like doesn't mean this works, the fact remains there are plenty of things wrong with it that has been showcased here, and even posted over there (only for the threads to be locked and deleted).

 

But it shouldn't be a case of "some people have it working OK", it should be working fine for everyone, and without fixes needed posted by other members like Digital Point. I just can't believe how much people's expectations off vBulletin has dropped these days.

I agree that XenForo is most likely not the answer for being a vBulletin 4 replacement right now as it stands. But that doesn't mean vBulletin is OK either. It's not, it's a train wreck.

Also, why are you talking like "it's OK to accept some bugs", Bugs should be fixed, plain and simple if IB are aware of them being there. There's no excuse can used, and using the excuse they are not show-stoppers (so that makes it OK) is pathetic.

 

It was in reply to Nicks post - which is probably why I quoted him???? - where he said that Keirs forum was working and vB4 doesnt and that is nothing but a straight out lie as vb4 does work there are just some bugs in it.

Everything you get has bugs - windows 7 has bugs, vista had bugs everything has bugs so complaining about the fact the button to last post doesn't work and claiming it as a show stopper it's pathetic.

 

vBulletin 4 is a load of trash, plain and simple. You can paint it up if you want too, but we all know what it is now, apart from you that is.

The vBulletin (promotion fan boy tricks) don't work anymore posted on other sites like this one, didn't you know that? That train left the station a long, long time ago.

Why do you think vBulletin is now a shadow of it's former self? People wise-up, came to their senses and left.

 

Oh as usual, like on every other forum you are on, if they don't agree with you all of a sudden they are a fan boy.

I am using vb4 and have no issues with it, many other forum administrators I talk to use it and don't have that many issues - as usual people see a needle and start calling it a sword when they go to the vb bug tracker.

Geez the image is 1px too big SHOW STOPPER BUG - Development team must respond within minutes and release a bug fix immediately.

It is really getting old, and I have to take my hat off to you at least your consistent - someone doesn't agree and straight away the fan boy insults come out - well done you're about on par with consistency as Tiger Woods is with his mistresses.

You always know there is going to be another Tiger Woods mistress, and when anyone talks about vBulletin 4 you can always garuntee that you will chip in to anyone who isn't crying foul over it and call them a Fan Boy!

 

Hey, if you like vBulletin 4 use it. That's your choice!

But trying to talk others into thinking it's now great won't work anymore. Like I said before, that train left the station a long time ago.

 

I am not attempting to tell people that all is perfect, but I am saying for those "FAN BOYS" of Kiers new forum software that at this current stage there is no forum softare all he has is a front end system, the same as whirlpool forums so trying to talk that up is a little slack.

And as I said my original post was in reply to Nick - which is why I quoted him - where he said that XenForo works and vB4 doesn't - which is an absolute misleading word as vB4 does work just not as good as some people would like.

And Xenforo doesn't have a product yet to be able to say that it works.

 

There has been one thread posted on XenForo "showcasing" what is wrong with XenForo that's been locked. And only because it got way out of hand. Any other examples please?

 

As I see it XenForo may be very nice forum software but that is all it is. I would think that most of us running successful sites for some time have more than just a forum. We also have things like a CMS (however defined) a gallery and assorted other things. Until these items are available XenForo will not be a serious contender.

How many of us just have a forum with nothing added? Not me...

 

When I said XenForo works and vBulletin doesn't, I didn't exactly mean it in a literal sense. I meant it more in that vBulletin 4 is not "the best" and has nothing "2010" about it. Compared to where IP.Board is headed and what XenForo has accomplished, vBulletin is so out-dated now.

My opinion is that vB 4 is horrendous. It's nothing like it should have or could have been before IB stepped in. Not only is the product quality diminishing, but the quality of the management now sits at ground zero. I do not want to buy from people who are out to get your money and nothing else. The IB developers and product managers now in charge of vBulletin don't quite seem to give a damn about the product itself. All they want is to keep customers quiet and collect some coin.

Just because I'm excited for XenForo before it's even released does not make me a fanboy. IMO, a fanboy is someone who supports something no matter how realistic that solution is. For example, if I went around touting that phpBB is the best forum software, even better than all the paid solutions (which we know it isn't), then I could fairly be considered a phpBB fanboy. I am a realist. I know what suits my needs, I know what I like, and I know what I think would be good for (my) forums. XenForo is now that. I would be lying if I said I remotely even liked vBulletin 4.

In terms of products currently available (right now), vB 3.8 is the best. It is the pinnacle of the vBulletin product, as everything goes downhill from there. I plan on keeping my forums on vB 3.8 (which they are currently running), but I may switch one to XenForo depending on how the product turns out (even though I'm pretty much sold for at least buying a license to test it out).

XenForo will be considered for any new projects, as I'm not going anywhere near vB 4, and I'm not contributing to the train wreck that is IB by purchasing their horrendous product.


I hope this clears up my alleged fanboy status, and helps you better understand where I stand and where I'm coming from.

 

My opinion on vb 3.8 - its years behind the times. And I dont mean just 1 or 2 years, its probably 3 or 4 years behind current internet trends.

Examples:

Where is the smart phone integration with vb 3.8? When someone replies to a subscribed thread, can I get an text message on my phone? Can I get reported post notifications sent to my phone? When someone post a comment in my picture gallery, can I get a notification?

Where is the social group subscription updates via smart phone?

Where is reply by email?

Where is bounced email management?

Back in 2001 and 2002 was the the first time I saw a content management system, which was postnuke and phpnuke. Given a 2 - 3 year development time, vbulletin should have had a CMS back in 2004, or 2005, not in December of 2009.

Vbulletin customers had been asking for a CMS before I bought my first license, which was in April 2007.

Companies need to stay ahead of the curve. A good comapny will deliver a product before a customer even knows they want or need it. If customers were asking for a CMS in 2006 - 2007, it should have been delivered in 2005. If a company waits until their customers are begging for something - that company is behind the times.

Then I take a look at XF, and the first thing that comes to mind is "these are the same developers that let vb fall years behind current internet trends." They can blame management all they want, but we all know that most managers will listen to their employees.

I personally blame the developers and the management both equally for VB falling behind the times. Lets not point the finger and try to place the blame on one group - like the management of VB. Spread the blame equally. Its called team work, if the team fails, everyone fails equally.

I see the XF project as a basic forum, and that is it. The developers did not keep VB up with current trends, I doubt they are going to keep XF with current trends.

If all I wanted was a forum, I could go get MYBB for free.

 

I never said vB 3.8 was perfect; all I said was that it's the best currently on the market, IMO.

Words cannot even describe how much I disagree with this segment, especially your last sentence. Running a company, running a business, and developing a product is not teamwork. There are the people who make the decisions, and there are the people who enact those decisions.

How can you blame the lead developer of the product when he is not in charge? Yes, he's the face of the product, he's who most people think of when they think "vBulletin", and yes, he was the one who communicated with customers the most (outside of support inquiries), but that does not make him the one in charge with any decision-making capabilities.

If a company comes out with a poorly designed product, do you blame the workers who manufactured it in the factory? No. You blame the people who came up with the design. If you don't like Wal-Mart's return policy, is the cashier responsible? Is it her fault that Wal-Mart's return policy sucks? No; the responsibility falls onto corporate management.

We will see. I have no way of knowing what's going to happen in the future, but I'm at least giving them the benefit of the doubt, to say the least. For one, these guys now call the shots, which I'm sure will mean things will be very different. And secondly, even if they were responsible for vB's lagging, don't you think maybe they learned from their mistakes?

 

I did not work at jelsoft, so I do not know "exactly" what happened. So to be on the safe side, everyone gets a piece of the blame pie.

Time will tell - that is for sure. We will have to sit back, wait, watch, and see what happens.