It is painful working with vBcover - iCart

@Lionel

All this could be avoided, what's so bad about refunding him for something he clearly paid for? Obviously that must be an issue for you or something. If you can't get it to work with his server, then just refund the money and leave the customer alone. You have over 30 clients right? I'm sure you should be focused on them, worrying about them, and just refund @WEfail and call it a day. At least, that's what I see is fully wrong here. The script doesn't work, this and that, who cares? Refund the money.

Since you're dropping solutions to the issues, why not implement them in the script for @WEfail? Stop beating around the bush.

You're just making yourself look bad in this thread, and another community that this was brought up at. You're being unprofessional about the whole situation. There's no reason to be treating a customer like this, at all.

 

Sure I could have refunded if the script did not work. But it does work just fine and I am not the only one saying that. He came to me for help. I tried very hard non stop for close to 15 hours until he shut me down and came up with some weird story about me shutting his server down for one week, preventing my access and then without warning or trying to negotiate put up a phony claim with PayPal against me and then went on a vengeful rant when it got denied. That surely will produce a lot of copycats if I were to give up. So I will never refund someone like that.

I don't give up on phony claims.

In fact I saw him today on my site looking at other scripts in my store. I hope he doesn't even attempt to buy any. His site is on a ban list and any attempt to download a new purchase will instantly be stopped

That solution could have been implemented just for him. But I got shut down right after I mentioned that to him.

Now dealing with such a person, if I were to try something and give him the zip, then he'll come up with something else about my new script having destroyed his server. Thanks but no thanks.

 

come to think of it, one of his so-called admin had a coder title under his name. So you come to me for help and you give me a jail access????? What was it for if not to grab my IP and come up with a phony claim trying to blame me for putting his server down???

 

Lionel, don't take this the wrong way but you seem to have taken hold of some parts of the entire thing and won't back down from those claims.

You say you weren't responsible for crashing his server and that you didn't even have root access. Ok fine, let's accept that as truth. Also, let's accept that when @WEfail did a paypal dispute, that wasn't the best way to handle it. He could have approached you about it beforehand. Would you have given him a refund if he was unable to get it working on his server? I honestly don't know the answer to that but from your TOS I would guess that you probably would not have given a refund. But then again, I don't honestly know -- only you know the answer to that.

Now the issue is this -- you're both accusing each other of stuff that isn't true. It is very far fetched to believe that @WEfail went through all these steps just to steal your script. That in itself is pretty ridiculous and I think that you're a smart guy and realize that if someone was interested in pirating your work, there would be much easier ways to go about doing so. But I understand, you are upset about the transaction, upset about the chargeback, and upset about the accusations.

Its also a bit far fetched for @WEfail to claim that you crashed his server without evidence of such. Correlation does not mean causation; two things happening at the same are not necessarily related. But I understand -- he is upset about paying money for something and not having it work properly, upset about being locked out of support, and also upset about being called a thief.

But when you throw all the name calling and exaggerated stories of diabolical motives to the side, what you're left with is a seller and a buyer who just weren't able to walk away mutually satisfied with the transaction.

@WEfail can't get the software to work on his server. Whether its his server's fault or your software's fault, we don't know. You say its the server's fault. You may be 100% correct. He thinks its the software's inability to properly work within the confines of a hardened server security configuration. He may also be 100% correct. It is very possible that your software works perfectly on the majority of routine server configurations but fails to work on a server configuration that is different from that default. The bottom line is that the customer was not able to use the product.

Now, what's left is for you as the seller to decide how you will deal with this incident. Obviously a lot of things went wrong in this transaction, but I think that myself, and others who will read this thread, will not see @WEfail as a person who's intention was to steal from you. Rather, his only motivation seemed to be to get your product working, and when he wasn't able to get it working, frustration boiled over and he reacted. The same could be said of your position -- you wanted to help him get his product working but when you felt that your efforts were not being recognized and you were being accused of things you did not do, your frustration also boiled over and you also reacted.

If both sides can step back from that and see that @WEfail is neither a scammer nor a thief, and that @Lionel is not responsible for the server crashing and the software not functioning properly on a custom server config, I think you would both go a long way in restoring the good faith on both sides.

@Lionel, you have stated that @WEfail still has access to the software, and therefore he does not deserve a refund. But if you know the guy is unable to get it to work, why not just give him the refund? You stated that you're worried about others trying to scam you if you process a refund, but I think that any goodwill and positive points towards your reputation as a business will easily overpower any vulnerability you are afraid of displaying to potential scammers.

If you continue to wrongly think that @WEfail is a thief/scammer, then I really don't know what else to say. The same goes for @WEfail thinking @Lionel's motivation was to crash your server when he offered to help. You both need to step back from the inciteful saber-rattling and take a fresh look at what's going on and then try to find an amicable solution.

In my opinion, offering a refund to a customer who is unable to use the product, would be a positive start.

 

After the very initial review of the problem you said your script could not zip anything other than .php files and stated NO REFUNDS!.
We inquired if we could just downgrade to the regular version and you said yes but you would be keeping the difference in price price. You also would not grant brand free. $109 is the value of the iCart that you downgraded me to and removed my brand free as well. You instantly kept the difference of $110..

Chain of events:
November 20th, 2012 - vBcover iCart Review – Put a bullet in my head!
November 25th, 2012 - Got some outside input about taking your suggestion of removing suhosin on vBorg. there were 4 replies, 1 said to play with suhosin, 2 outright said NO and 1 was not a direct answer to my questions. Further that I spoke to the sys admins who have worked on the box and one unfamiliar. While not all are familiar with vBcover, iCart and the one was not 100% upto speed on the server config they all said the same thing. If it has worked for years now, why modify your security preferences.
November 25th, 2012 - I filed the paypal dispute
November 25th, 2012 -You immediately escalated the dispute
November 26th, 2012 - vBcover – iCart Review for vBulletin 3
November 29th, 2012 - vBcover Says I am the scammer. lol (1:15 am Eastern i uploaded the images. ex)
November 29th, 2012 - vBcover iCart Review Drama – Whos the scammer. LOL (12:22pm Eastern i uploaded the images. ex)
November 29th, 2012 - 6:10 pm eastern Paypal Ruled in your favor. Non-tangible.
November 30th, 2012 - vBcover iCart Review for vBulletin – Lionel calls customers a*holes

My review of icart started long before the dispute resolution.

If you want to refund, I accept it. However, I will not take a refund and change my opinion of your service or product.

Lionel, everyone including you should stick up for what you believe in.

I just flew back from France with a brief case full of new credit cards!!!

PLEASE, Lionel. Stop posting you are done with the threads and then returning to update your facts and story. You have the $200+ or whatever it is. I have my opinion on iCart. One will go a lot further in the world than the other.

 

Well, I got nothing against him. In fact I am beginning to love him. I made 9 more sales and they all came from that thread and from vBseo thread. And I got more testimonials too, which really made my day. That encourages me when people are appreciating my work.

Now, I am not sure at which point I should have refunded him.

1 - When he first came to me screaming that my script was not working because he could not encode images?
2- or After I explained to him that ioncube does not encode images and he came back screaming again that he just put a php file and that was not encoding? And after 2 hours of troubleshooting in the blind, I realized that he was using the decoder to encode instead of encoder?
3- After I provided him a script to get the full path from root and him insisting that he put up the script and when I tried to access from the web it was not there?
5 - after not knowing what was going on and still in the blind I asked him to chmod some files and that made a big deal?
6- After I finally told him that I needed access so I could see things for myself?
7- After a jailed access was given to me, could not go any further and he came back to me, gave me root access but still could not get in, requested my IP so he could unblock it and yet still no access?
8- After I suggested to him to upgrade to vBulletin 4.2.0 for his own good and that turned out to be a big deal? or after I suggested to him for his own protection to place his download files above root and he complained that I told him to rearrange his forum structure?
9 After I told him that my Skype was crashing my PC and gave him my private phone number that he requested and never used?
10- After he mentioned suhosin to me and me still troubleshooting in the dark did a search and saw that suhosin creates some problems and told him so, if not properly configured. And that turned into a big deal?
11-- After he started screaming that I put his server down and kept at it for one week.
12- After his claim against me with PayPal?
13- After he started spreading garbage about me?
13- After I found out that site WAS NOT DOWN?

OR should have just given him the script for free to start with or better pay him to get it?

 

Except that i'm an [****][****][****][****][****][****][****], a thief and not smart.


lol

 

learn to read. I said ioncube could not ENCODE anything but PHP, not the images that you were trying to. LOL. I did mention to you that I also speak French and Spanish very fluently if English was a problem for you.

and this sort of smart misinterpretation has been going on from day one. Perhaps it was then I should have reimburse you???

I had a really bad week thanks to you. But also thanks to you I had 11 sales (total) from your nasty posts and 2 great reviews (most of my reviews are about iCart by the way)

 

Lionel, this is the problem. This is how you treat your customers. This is why I claimed you were arrogant after your support tickets were rude and at that, didn't resolve the issue.

I cannot read that which I cannot access. You have removed my access to the support tickets. Why do we have to keep going over this? I have paid for the product and you have locked me out. So iCart does not work, I have no access to support tickets and you are running around claiming I tried to buy your product with a stolen credit... the list goes on. My claims are pretty straight forward and hopefully are conveyed in a logical manner in my iCart reviews.

You should have reimbursed me when it felt right for you. If I had been in your position it would have been the minute I knew it was not going to work.

 

Well you had given me dozens of things that were not working, all due to your own logic. And as I was troubleshooting after 9-15 hours non stop, all issues due to you or your poor admin knowledge (no one could figure out that you were using a decoder and ioncube also does not encode images and my script was blamed for that), when still in the dark I felt I was getting close with that suhosin perhaps the culprit, YOU SHUT ME DOWN. 15 freakin hours I wasted and 1 full week feeling bad, for you, not for me, I had no access.

Get your act straight and you will have a perfectly well working script like every one else. But that's not what you wanted. You put a claim against me, PayPal transmitted a temporary reversal to my server and that disabled your access and you complained about that. Go figure!

 

Hmm, I never really leave any reviews about a site vendor but this thread really got me smh and felt the urge to interject...

I was in the market for a shopping cart/vBulletin and Google sent me here. I've been reading these threads for a couple of days so I went to vBcover to investigate further. After exploring their demo and reading a few testimonials, I decided to chance iCart and purchased it.

And now...well, I must say although I do not completely understand what really transpired between these two, after installing and using the cart the first day, I found it to be extremely powerful and easy to use, as described. My admin did have a couple of questions at first but answers were virtually instant.. and pleasant. We are really pleased with both the cart and support that we received; in fact, I immediately purchased iBid and iShop, browsed through others and just contracted for a major layaway site. After reviewing other proposals, after my admin strongly advised to use them and after personally experiencing iCart, we made our own assessment and decided that they are the right people for the job. We just gave them the deposit so that they could start production and looking forward to it.

So, my interjection comes with hopes that these two come to a quick, clean resolution. I suggest that you try to solve your issues with them. I was not disappointed with their work and feel that others won't be as well. Let's move forward successfully.

--AR

 

If you ever have a change of heart we wrote a How To Uninstall iCart post.

May I also suggest instead of using Lionel for coding you consider going to Odesk and sourcing there. Have Lionel compete with their rates. There are tons of competent developers over there who will work for a fraction of the cost.
Here is a quick blog on advice on hiring a developer.

 

So 2 interesting things....

1 - paypal contacted me about my dispute and said when working "specifically" with e-tailers like Lionel one should always use a credit card for payment, NOT funds from your paypal accounts as to not get scammed by guys like this.... you can charge back. While the PayPal rep couldn't speak specifically about Lionels account with me he wanted to know they don't like siding with guys like this who are known to sell non-tangible non working software. Apparently it is common with "certain" people.

2- another happy vBcover customer (not)
"vBCart? Absolutely horrible support, requires Ioncube, and was possibly the most painful vB-related purchase/install/complain that I have ever experienced. "
https://www.vbulletin.com/forum/showthread.php/318659-vBulletin-Webshop-(shopping-cart)

I regret purchasing that garbage software. Life is better without it.

Happy Holidays !

PS. a better cart solution
http://www.itvault.com/osc_product_info.php?products_id=2&osCsid=cda2f5ec93662ac482adf6510c0f72d4

 

First of all, paypal would never suggest that you use a credit card nor would they use the word "e-tailer." Second, you're one of the worst types to deal with. Anyone who wants to read about personality disorders, f***ups like wefail, and how to split legal fees like a dinner check, please visit: www.rick-perry-is-scamming-you.com/

Canada and proxies are blocked.

 

I'm not in Canada or do I run a proxy @divisionbyzero and it's showing blocked to me..

 

http://www.cueblip-scammedme.com/

there's nothing there. is some deranged mind game Chris Candler is trying to play to scare me.

Chris (divisionbyzero) is also on the way to Canada to sue me, as of December 18 2012.

Ryan & Lionel..sitting in a tree.

 

you are the only guy that I know of using multiple pseudos just to try to intimidate people so you could steal from them. Sorry to see that I am not the only one you tried to rob. Looks like your gimmick is catching up with you

 

Seems that way Lionel.

Lionel and Chris Candler. Who would have thought. I guess sooner or later 2 turds in a toilet do meet up down the line.

Unfortunately for you Lionel. You are paid. I never scammed you. You scammed me with your crappy vBcover iCart garbage.

Sometimes when I can't find my vBcover iCart review, I google it.

As for Chris Candler (divisionbyzero)

Posted yesterday on vBulletin.org

discuss?

Side note. Chris, you were doing a whole lot better when you were pretending to be dead and having your friends contact me saying you suicided over the stresses of the net and that I should take the site down out of respect for your "partner" (gay lover).

 

you are really a POS thinking everybody has time to waste like the moron thief that you are.

and as far as I am concern, YOU belong to the toilet. You must be gay to have such an attitude, lady. If you itch that bad, go look somewhere else, fag.

 

oh..