The reason for the lack of mods for VB5

Reading a thread on vb.org yesterday which was originally asking about TAZ moving of vb.
As the progression of the thread went on, Zachery gave the reason for the lack of mods for vb5

It was not through people binning vb and moving onto other forum software, it was down to the lack of the hook system that has been used in all the earlier versions. Which in turn, has made creating add on's very hard.
http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/showpost.php?p=2506774&postcount=21

But, in typical IB fashion, this wont be brought back with common sense prevailing, but only through customers voting for its return.
Vote for it here
http://tracker.vbulletin.com/browse/VBV-10333

 

It seams to me that VB5 is an unmitigated balls up from the word go, no planing or for thought to the basics, it goes to show how poor management can destroy a good product and reputation.

 

Even the vb staff on the org had a few choice words with Zachery over needing to vote for the hooks implementation on the above linked thread
So it shows the staff are on the end users side

 

I thought vB5 was supposed to be MVC and purely OOP with the ability to extend the classes. If that is true, then theoretically, there shouldn't be any need for the old hooks and that would be the actual problem. The system is totally different, which means porting an add-on over to vB5 needs a 100% rewrite. Add that effort to the fact vB5 is a flop from an adoption or selling standpoint and the other fact that there is absolutely no documentation about how to program add-ons for vB5 and you then have zero motivation built up within add-on dev community to make add-ons.

Scott

 

Looking at the way this thread has gone on the org, its looks like an idea that's gone tits up
http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/showthread.php?t=311961&page=4

Paul M mentions he was asked to remove the hooks
VB5 no hooks
VB5 IB started to do the cloud hosting
No hook system, would mean no easy addition of mods to it
In turn, upgrading all the sites on the cloud would be easy, since no mods can be added

At a guess, that's probably one of the reasons the hook system got pulled

As a result, no mods are being made for vb5

 

Even if they added HOOKS for mods to use (which didn't know vB5 didn't have) in the first place. Hmm. Well, who's going to invest time creating mods for it anyhow, even if having hooks when nobody wants to use vB5. Really don't see it making much difference either way, hooks their or not. If people ain't interested in using vB5, then demand for mods isn't their either, nor people wanting to waste their time creating any for it.

Also, if they've removed hooks from vB5 and none get put back in. What real purpose does vB.org serve now as a modding community worth keeping going. Especially so if they end up shelving vB3 and vB4 at some point and left with vB5 that used no hooks for mods.

 

Scott;

I do wish you would check your "facts" before you post them, a simple search on Google for "Creating MODs for VB5" comes up with this :

http://www.vbulletin.com/forum/blogs/joe-d/3932614-

It is false claims like this that cause people to jump on bandwagons.

 

On this reply by BOP
http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/showpost.php?p=2507034&postcount=61

Again, makes me wonder if it was something to do with the vb5 cloud hosting

Strange how the unsafe method of hooks was in so many other versions of vb

 

Oh, well. Sorry I didn't see that. I knew for a fact such a guide wasn't in the official docs and that is what I based my "facts" on.

Scott

 

Understandable, but that has been around for well over a year, and as you saw is quite comprehensive for a "simple" guide

 

Actually, I just read the blog a bit more in detail. This right here suggests to me this system for modifications was going to be hard to sell to add-on devs from the beginning.

Scott

 

Precisely. Reading through the code in itself is a difficult task as it's so poorly written.

 

I've read a couple other comments in this direction in the past. Though, I wish a very experienced programmer would do a review about the code quality and why it is so poorly written.

Scott

 

Rafio did back in 2012.

http://vbtruth.com/vbulletin-5-code-review-by-rafio/460/

Edit: Here's a better formatted version.
https://theadminzone.com/threads/vb...opers-making-addons.115121/page-4#post-815212

 

Oh, I remember the rafio review...now. The second one is better formatted.

A second opinion would hit it home. I guess, since nobody from IB or any other dev came to defend vB from this review, we can determine the vB5 code really is a..........

..............."Massive pile of dung?"

Maybe we could use one more current review, since they've had almost 2 years to improve it? Like looking at why the index still takes 120+ queries to render the page? The overall architecture, that makes someone who wrote how to create an add-on for vB5 say something along the lines of, when you first start making add-ons for vB5, learning where everything is to extend it, is difficult. Why is it difficult? How new devs, who need to learn to program for vB5? Would they have the same difficulty to learn its ropes? Why? And so on and so forth.

Edit, funny that thread with the rafio code review is about the same topic as this one, just many moons earlier.

Scott

 

Ok, I just reread the review and this hit me.

That is a main issue. And Trevor gives reason to what is the cause of this issue.

The new "Themes" feature is another great example. Take one of the few "greater schemes" the software even has and screw that up too. LOL! It is so ridiculously funny and seriously sad all at the same time. I think Shawn masterfully expresses the situation.

I think, until IB starts to make a serious dent in this kind of "review" in the form of other people saying, "Hey, they've turned it around. It isn't massive pile of dung anymore, but rather a coolly programmed software", vB5 will stay a sad and very unfortunate flop.

Scott

 

It appears people have been voting with their feet. Walking away from a good thing gone bad and getting worse for other platforms less troublesome is the purchasers right. Who in their right mind would invest hundreds of hard earned dollars on any company that misrepresents their product?

 

The question at the minute is "how much longer will vBulletin last", not if they can turn things around. They managed to extend the vBulletin life expectancy by bringing along the vBCloud thing, but for how long? Doesn't look like many are buying vB5, and those that do don't seem to last 2 minutes running it after spotting all the issues using it - before getting shut and moving to another like XF.

 

Been looking at the add on's again today for vb5
Not one single anti spam add on there

Then I looked at the vb4 add on's, all looked good until you found most of the mods are no longer supported. Devs have not been on for a long time

Looks like most the mods on the org are held together with blue tac and sticky back plastic, unless they have been released by members of staff there

Cluster fook springs to mind

 

How many mods are there for vB5