Another vBulletin 5 forum has asked for a refund.

vBulletin.org is the The Official vBulletin Modifications Site.

It is run by volunteers. Whether we are employed by VB or not we are not on the clock when we are providing support on vBulletin.org.

Any person of reasonable intelligence should be able to understand vb.com is the official site for feedback and vb.org is not.

If you wish to change the nature of vb.org the only place to provide such feedback would be in the vb.com licensed customer feedback forum. Irony. :p

 

Exactly what link / URL can't you access?

 

The thread on VB.org titled "VB5 is a joke"

 

That thread was likely deleted if it was on vBulletin.org (moved to a deleted items forum) because vbulletin.org does not put up with bullshit.

Complain about VB5 on vbulletin.com. The Site Feedback forum is public, nothing is hidden in that forum.

 

I am quite happy with a forum that helps with modifications. And indeed I have complimented some staff for the hard work they do.

What I object to, is that VB.org has a section where we are INVITED. to post comments OTHER than mod comments and yet when we do, we have our posts deleted and some are banned for posting in a section that VB.org says is for other topics.
Then to top it all off we then receive sarcastic comments from the very people who say they are volunteers there to assist us.

IE= "This forum intends to host any kind of chat except vBulletin and modification issues!"

 

Did you read what you posted?

"This forum intends to host any kind of chat except vBulletin and modification issues!"

And you complain when threads about vBulletin are locked or deleted?

 

In other words it was HIDDEN. EXACTLY as has been quoted.

Can you see why your posts are not received very well?

Since when are the valid and genuine comments of your customers considered as bullshit?

You state that you are happy to help people with their VB issues and this is great, but then you turn around and insult them. Joe I really am shaking my head in disbelief at the attitude of the seniors on VB.org that is supposedly set up to ASSIST VB customers.

Joe, why do you think so many are leaving and joining up with VB's competitors. I will give you a hint, READ THE COMMENTS

Joe, I appreciate the fact that you have come on here to answer questions, however it is clearly out of the understanding of the VB.org staff as to how customers should be treated.

 

So the comments about the lack of customer support, should be moved to this section then?

Now Joe, if I post copies of all my posts on here about the lack of support by the VB.org staff into the feedback thread they will be allowed to stay there? As it is feedback?

 

Yes Joe, I am human and I make mistakes.

The main thing to consider is that I will own up to my mistakes, How about you?

 

vBulletin.org does not have customers, we do not sell anything.

I have proved to you time and time again in this thread you are simply wrong. Just because you "feel" vb.org should be like vb.com that doesn't make it so.

A comment is not valid if not posted on the right site. If I go to your site and make a post about why I dislike President Obama in your "Scam Help" forum, would you delete it? You should. Because at best it's in the wrong forum and it likely has no business on your site at all. This is exactly the same about VB5 complaints on vb.org. You don't have to like it, you don't even have to agree- but that is the way it is. Arguing anymore is pointless.

 

So as I have asked, if I post my comments on VB.org in the feedback section ABOUT the way VB.org treats its members, then the posts will not be removed or deleted and I will not be suspended or banned?

 

Let me ask you... Do you think "lack of customer support" is a Site Feedback issue? When I think of "Site Feedback" I think of feedback on the physical site or the software that runs it. That would be complaints about VB5 as it runs on vbulletin.com.

The vBulletin.org staff do not provide official support, so if you wish to complain the volunteers aren't providing you with the free support you've come to expect I suppose Licensed Customer Feedback is the better choice, but truthully I don't think you have any basis to complain- Official support is provided on vb.com, not vb.org.

If you point out a mistake I've made I will apologize for it and work/look to see how it happened and what I can do to make sure it doesn't happen again.

I accept your apology for implying vb.org staff abused their powers by deleting a thread that was quite obviously on a topic specically forbidded by the forum description.

 

Well at least you'd have the right forum- however it would depend on how you actually worded your post- if it was honest feedback and constructive criticism I wouldn't delete the post or ban you. I can't promise what other people may or may not do- because it is a difficult line to walk to complain about such topics while not looking like a troll.

Understand first vb.org has memebrs, not customers. Understand we do not provide official support- we provide support at our leisure. The main point is a place to get support from other members AND a place to share free vbulletin modifications. Understand whether we are separately employed by VB or not (about half the staff I believe are not), we are not "on the clock" when on vBulletin.org.

If after all those considerations you feel you still have a valid complaint then yes, I suggest you go ahead and try.

 

Totally incorrect, I have never stated that I feel VB.org should be like VB.com. Earlier you asked another member NOT to put words into your mouth, please show me the same consideration.
To be honest I have only visited VB.com a few times and have, to the best of my knowledge never compared the two.

As for you first part on the post, I think you proved me to be wrong in one post. All the rest you are incapable of answering the actual questions and in many cases your statements were shown to be incorrect.
Like where you said you were not hiding things, then admitting you removed or deleted a whole thread thereby admitting that it was Hidden by being removed from sight.

 

My answers here were based on vBulletin.com- We are not hiding the fact VB5 has problems and we are not hiding the fact many customers are unhappy with VB5. When I say "We" I am talking about we the staff at vBulletin (the commercial product). I offered proof by posting links to vb.com threads you can view as a guest.

vb.org never figured into my mind because vb.org is not a valid place to crticisize VB5. Threads deleted there are deleted for being off topic or trolling or other nonsense. They weren't deleted to hide the problems with VB5.

 

Joe I have pointed out to you many mistakes you have made in the past. Including your support of a self confessed scammer and hacker who you are supporting on your own forum.

Your continuously posting untruths and lies to your members. In order to defame people. Proven by copies of your OWN messages.
Your mistake in breaching confidentiality by posting confidential information gleaned from your position as a VB staff member. ETC. Shall I go on?

Many times I have offered to discuss these with you, yet you always run away. Why should I expect anything different this time?

No Joe, The mistakes you have posted on here are self evident, but I am sure you will not admit to them.

VB.org seniors have promoted VB5 in many ways, so are culpable in misleading the VB customers.

The posting of misleading comments about how good VB5 is shows a lack of ethics.

The blaming of the customers for buying VB5 is deplorable. Another mistake, you keep saying that they are at fault as they did not do their research.
What about the people who purchased VB5 when it first came out BEFORE the news was available that it was a load of crap was apparent? and the main basis was the propaganda put out by VB its self saying that it was great and the platform that all others will follow.Yada yada yada.

 

Point in question is the thread " VB5 is a joke" suddenly pulled with no explanation and then falsely accusing members of posting bullshit.

So are you actually saying that ALL the posts in that thread were BS? If not all, why were the others not left alone? or at least moved to the feedback area.

 

Not quite what I said. I said...

And just because the decision to hide the licensed customer feedback forum was made before you became staff, doesn't mean you shouldn't care about the situations that makes your job more difficult.

I've been in the vB support business for over 12 years and not once do I know of a time, when I had to tell only customers something in private. So no, that isn't an excuse for having such a hidden forum.

And it was a damn crappy explanation too. I seem to remember the explanation was something like....

"We decided not to use the gold status, like it or lump it."

Who said there was a conspiracy? Now you are putting words in my mouth.

Point is, you admitted there is enough bad news about vB5 to warn a smart person shopping for the software, that the software isn't pedigree software. And I am saying, that bad news is mostly also true.

Well good for you.

Are you reading those emails? Do you agree vB5 is the best forum software ever?

Me blind? Oh brother. I guess we'll have to leave there. You obviously have to side with the crap IB pulls and surely do a good job at side stepping every valid point I make.

And no, I will not change my views should my own product hit the market or any time after that. I will go to the grave with what I think is the right way to deliver any product or service. These are also things IB doesn't do!

Deliver quality first!!!!
If you make a mistake, own up to it. Learn from it.
Customers and their needs are above all others.
Quality first!!!!
Innovation is great, but only when customers accept it wholeheartedly. If they don't, find out why.
Quality first!!!!
If you can't get the innovation or new feature right, so customers do accept it, trash it fast.
Don't think you are above any customer, they pay for your living.
Marketing is an integral part of the delivery/ release process, in that it is there to inform customers about what is new. Training is a part of Marketing. It is not just some department responsible for generating more sales.
Don't write BS in any marketing correspondence. Simply do good and talk in detail about it.
Don't hide a mistake. Show you know about it, tell people what you are going to do about it and show you care. The faster you say "sorry", the faster everyone can concentrate on the solutions.
As a leader, if there is a crisis, get out in front of everyone else, in front of your team and take responsibility. Take the heat off of them.
Oh BTW, did I say, Quality first!!!!

Scott

 

For the 99th time, that thread was deleted because it was a topic specifically forbidden in the forum description "You can talk about anything EXCEPT X and Y" and the thread was about X. The only mistake made was it should have been deleted sooner. There may well have been good points raised but they were raised on the wrong site so they are gone. I'm sure people make good points in bars at 2am on why someone should be found guilty of some crime, but if they don't make that point in court in front of a jury, it doesn't matter.

We also never give explanation when we delete threads so that doesn't mean anything- we don't need to explain our actions on threads clearly against the rules. There is no feedback forum on vb.org the thread would belong in, at best it needs to be on vb.com.

Even if one or two posts may have been valid feedback we are volunteers, we're not going to cherry pick a thread that breaks the rules to find a couple of posts that besmirch our name but do so within the rules... the burden is on the poster to make sure they are posting in accordance with the rules if they want their post read, not us to put them in the right place- though we often will in tech related questions- but not for someone to rant why they don't like us.

 

Reasons may have nothing to do with support. Maybe we want to release a coupon code only for loyal customers? Maybe we want to talk about our anti-piracy efforts without tipping off the pirates... There could well be reasons you only want to reach confirmed customers.